Comments on: Race and baseball http://itsaboutthemoney.net/archives/2010/03/10/race-and-baseball/ It's About The Money - A New York Yankees Blog Wed, 23 May 2012 00:46:12 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.2 By: jose http://itsaboutthemoney.net/archives/2010/03/10/race-and-baseball/comment-page-1/#comment-171 jose Thu, 11 Mar 2010 01:15:00 +0000 http://itsaboutthemoney.net/?p=11709#comment-171 I live in the burbs of long island, tons of kids play n follow baseball, its just not the same in the inner cities//boros, alot of Spanish//Latin w/e u wanna call them will follow but not so much play. There is a hoop almost every 20 feet you look sometimes. Baseball needs like 10 kids to play and equipment. Basketball? All you need is a ball, hell you don't even need your own just show up to the park on a warm day. Is that why soccer is world wide popular? I've seen kids MAKE a ball out of trash and kick it around, you literally can't be too poor to play that game. Maybe access to the game plays a big role Even the music, rap often talks about basketball as being 1 of the only ways to get out of the "hood". How many football players come out of inner city's? I live in the burbs of long island, tons of kids play n follow baseball, its just not the same in the inner cities//boros, alot of Spanish//Latin w/e u wanna call them will follow but not so much play. There is a hoop almost every 20 feet you look sometimes. Baseball needs like 10 kids to play and equipment. Basketball? All you need is a ball, hell you don't even need your own just show up to the park on a warm day. Is that why soccer is world wide popular? I've seen kids MAKE a ball out of trash and kick it around, you literally can't be too poor to play that game. Maybe access to the game plays a big role Even the music, rap often talks about basketball as being 1 of the only ways to get out of the "hood". How many football players come out of inner city's?

]]> By: Jose http://itsaboutthemoney.net/archives/2010/03/10/race-and-baseball/comment-page-1/#comment-170 Jose Thu, 11 Mar 2010 00:59:00 +0000 http://itsaboutthemoney.net/?p=11709#comment-170 b4 i even read the rest of this thing, u can be black and dominican, white and dominican, people have no idea that race color nationality and ethnicity are all entirely separate things, race is kinda made bs but, his color is black, his race is what they call it negroid? unless they updated that term and his ethnicity is DR, i assume he was born there so his nationality would be the same b4 i even read the rest of this thing, u can be black and dominican, white and dominican, people have no idea that race color nationality and ethnicity are all entirely separate things, race is kinda made bs but, his color is black, his race is what they call it negroid? unless they updated that term and his ethnicity is DR, i assume he was born there so his nationality would be the same

]]> By: Larry http://itsaboutthemoney.net/archives/2010/03/10/race-and-baseball/comment-page-1/#comment-166 Larry Wed, 10 Mar 2010 19:38:38 +0000 http://itsaboutthemoney.net/?p=11709#comment-166 It is difficult to talk about race.  I would tend to cut Torii Hunter some slack -- he's always struck me as a good guy -- because it is difficult to talk about race. In your post, the thing that stands out is the trend line showing a steep decline in African-American MLB participation.  That's a cause for concern.  For the moment, ignore the reasons for the decline, and focus on the decline itself.   Why is it that this generation has put so few African-Americans on MLB baseball diamonds?  Does this generation have many undiscovered Torii Hunters out there?  I'm tempted to point out that while African-Americans are underrepresented in baseball, they are overrepresented in football and basketball.  Could it be that African-American athletes are disproportionally drawn to these two sports, to the exclusion of baseball?  This seems unlikely to me.  Basketball generally requires athletes to be unusually tall; football generally requires athletes to have unusual combinations of size and speed.   Even given the popularity of football and basketball, there should be a substantial number of African-American athletes remaining to play baseball at the highest levels. I think that the contrast with football and basketball is instructive.  In basketball, they say that you can't teach someone to be tall.  It's also true that finding a tall athlete takes little scouting talent.  It's similar in football: it doesn't take much for a scout to notice that an athlete weighs 220 lbs and can run the 40 in 4.4.  Arguably, baseball talent (in particular, young and raw baseball talent) is harder to spot.    Baseball scouting takes a more sustained commitment. Another contrast between baseball and football/basketball is the relative importance of each in college sport.   Let's look at this from my Southern California perspective: if there's a talented athlete playing high school football in a poor Southern California neighborhood, what are the chances that U.S.C. would miss out on that player?  If that same athlete was successful in high school basketball, what are the chances that U.C.L.A. would fail to notice?  There is intense competition among division I schools for young talent.  Is the competition the same for young baseball talent?  I don't think so.  This means to me that some of this talent might be missed.  (on the topic of college baseball, note that only 6% of college baseball players are black.  That's hard to understand.  <a href="http://hamptonroads.com/2009/07/case-disappearing-black-baseball-player" rel="nofollow">http://hamptonroads.com/2009/07/case-disappearing-black-baseball-player</a>) Ultimately, I come back to my original thought, which is that it is difficult to talk about race.   It is easier to talk about baseball.  I want to see a MLB filled with great baseball players.  There's no question that baseball became a better sport when the color barrier was broken.  I'm not just saying that the sport became more just and more American -- I'm saying that the quality of play on the field improved dramatically.  I'm thinking of the great African-American players of my childhood: Frank Robinson, Bob Gibson, Willie Mays, Ernie Banks, Willie Stargell, Hank Aaron, Lou Brock.  I'm probably missing 50 other guys who played just as well.  I cannot imagine what baseball would have been like without half of these guys, or 3/4 of these guys.  Yet, that's the baseball we have now, given the 50% - 75% decline in the number of active African-American players. I have to conclude that this decline is terrible for the game of baseball.  Regardless of the cause. It is difficult to talk about race.  I would tend to cut Torii Hunter some slack — he’s always struck me as a good guy — because it is difficult to talk about race.

In your post, the thing that stands out is the trend line showing a steep decline in African-American MLB participation.  That’s a cause for concern.  For the moment, ignore the reasons for the decline, and focus on the decline itself.   Why is it that this generation has put so few African-Americans on MLB baseball diamonds?  Does this generation have many undiscovered Torii Hunters out there? 

I’m tempted to point out that while African-Americans are underrepresented in baseball, they are overrepresented in football and basketball.  Could it be that African-American athletes are disproportionally drawn to these two sports, to the exclusion of baseball?  This seems unlikely to me.  Basketball generally requires athletes to be unusually tall; football generally requires athletes to have unusual combinations of size and speed.   Even given the popularity of football and basketball, there should be a substantial number of African-American athletes remaining to play baseball at the highest levels.

I think that the contrast with football and basketball is instructive.  In basketball, they say that you can’t teach someone to be tall.  It’s also true that finding a tall athlete takes little scouting talent.  It’s similar in football: it doesn’t take much for a scout to notice that an athlete weighs 220 lbs and can run the 40 in 4.4.  Arguably, baseball talent (in particular, young and raw baseball talent) is harder to spot.    Baseball scouting takes a more sustained commitment.

Another contrast between baseball and football/basketball is the relative importance of each in college sport.   Let’s look at this from my Southern California perspective: if there’s a talented athlete playing high school football in a poor Southern California neighborhood, what are the chances that U.S.C. would miss out on that player?  If that same athlete was successful in high school basketball, what are the chances that U.C.L.A. would fail to notice?  There is intense competition among division I schools for young talent.  Is the competition the same for young baseball talent?  I don’t think so.  This means to me that some of this talent might be missed. 

(on the topic of college baseball, note that only 6% of college baseball players are black.  That’s hard to understand.  http://hamptonroads.com/2009/07/case-disappearing-black-baseball-player)

Ultimately, I come back to my original thought, which is that it is difficult to talk about race.   It is easier to talk about baseball.  I want to see a MLB filled with great baseball players.  There’s no question that baseball became a better sport when the color barrier was broken.  I’m not just saying that the sport became more just and more American — I’m saying that the quality of play on the field improved dramatically.  I’m thinking of the great African-American players of my childhood: Frank Robinson, Bob Gibson, Willie Mays, Ernie Banks, Willie Stargell, Hank Aaron, Lou Brock.  I’m probably missing 50 other guys who played just as well.  I cannot imagine what baseball would have been like without half of these guys, or 3/4 of these guys.  Yet, that’s the baseball we have now, given the 50% – 75% decline in the number of active African-American players.

I have to conclude that this decline is terrible for the game of baseball.  Regardless of the cause.

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